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Not sure the year/miles of your truck but that doesn't seem too bad, now you get to shop for a new one!
That's a great number. I'm trying to trade my '14 w/ 84k miles & they won't even give me KBB trade-in. Granted $24k is "replacement" cost. I think I'm going to start driving it like I stole it... worse case, I would start fitting in with the rest of the f***ed drivers.
 

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Discussion Starter #43
Not sure the year/miles of your truck but that doesn't seem too bad, now you get to shop for a new one!
It was a 2016 with 96k on it. Kicking the tires on a 2015 laramie 2500 right now. I just dont know if I trust another diesel.
 

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Discussion Starter #44
Wow I just received this from FCA:


This will further acknowledge contact to FCA US LLC, regarding your 2016 Ram 1500.

Naturally, we were sorry to learn of this incident. Please rest assured, we appreciate and share your concerns about vehicle safety. It is important for you to remember that we don’t just design and build vehicles; we also drive them, as do most of our families and friends. We have some very close and personal reasons to be concerned about vehicle safety, like you, people depend on us to provide them with safe and dependable transportation. Needless to say, we sincerely regret the unfortunate fire that occurred.

FCA US LLC provided for Engineering Analysis Associates/Bosch Automotive Service Solutions to examine your vehicle. EAA is a leading supplier of technical field support to the transportation industry. They have hundreds of specialists in the United States that conduct thousands of product investigations each year, providing valuable automotive field expertise. FCA feels that the expense of this independent inspection is in the best interest of you, our customer, and the Corporation in our efforts to properly evaluate serious concerns such as yours.

The inspection involved a thorough examination of your vehicle and the photographing of all critical areas. After the inspection of your vehicle, the information at hand would not permit us to associate the fire with a manufacturing or assembly error. We are sure you will understand fires of this nature can and do occur for a number of reasons not associated with the manufacturing process. Therefore, we must respectfully decline any assistance associated with this matter.

Based on this, we suggest that you refer this matter to your insurance carrier. Should they feel a manufacturing responsibility exists, they have full subrogation rights under the terms of your policy, including your deductible.

Thank you for allowing us the opportunity in reviewing this matter with you.

Special Investigations
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I say bullshit.
 

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That's pretty much standard procedure. It's up to your insurance company to do further investigation if they feel they need to. Depending on the investigation results, they may or may not choose to subrogate the claim.
 

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your right. I asked Aaron if he knew anyone with a eco on that site and he didnt know anyone. What is your first name and company
Steve.......and we are his fireplace contractors. I manage from our head office. He used to schedule through me before he passed that over to Joe.
I lived in Shelburne for 17 years before moving to Oro-Medonte two years ago. I knew that the only thing going on in Shelburne for someone to drive to for work would have to be his job site.
 

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Steve.......and we are his fireplace contractors. I manage from our head office. He used to schedule through me before he passed that over to Joe.
I lived in Shelburne for 17 years before moving to Oro-Medonte two years ago. I knew that the only thing going on in Shelburne for someone to drive to for work would have to be his job site.
Thanks i will let my son know. I have a 2017 eco and love it. Its good to know people like you are around to help us with our trucks
 

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$24k would put a nice dent in the down payment on a 2500...assuming you were not upside down the payments for the ED.
hopefully this thread gets back on topic.
let us know what you decide regarding a replacement.
Not surprised at all the FCA is passing the buck...I love my Mopars, but their customer care leaves something to be desired.
 
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Discussion Starter #49
$24k would put a nice dent in the down payment on a 2500...assuming you were not upside down the payments for the ED.
hopefully this thread gets back on topic.
let us know what you decide regarding a replacement.
Not surprised at all the FCA is passing the buck...I love my Mopars, but their customer care leaves something to be desired.
I wish I was getting 24k lol I am walking away with 5k after my deductible. The 2500 I looked at today was very well kept im a little worried about the mileage though. Its got 72k
 

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If it’s a well kept 2500 Cummins, I personally wouldn’t have any concerns at all with 72k for mileage...

Depending on pricing it’s usually better to let someone else take the new vehicle depreciation hit ..

Check the front crankshaft seal for leaking, It seems like all the Cummins 6.7’s eventually start leaking from this seal ... It’s a very easy fix , usually around 400.00 replacement cost...
worth looking at for a little wiggle room on pricing....

My brothers 2018 Cummins with 24 k started sweating oil , he had it replaced under warranty.. My 2016 Cummins 44k still dry ....
 

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That’s not but around 13 k miles a year. That’s below average if it was a daily.


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The Cummins can be a 1/2 million mile vehicle or more. Now if you do not tow, look at another Ram 1500 with the Pentastar V6 gas motor. Superb reliability and fuel mileage.
 

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Wow I just received this from FCA:


This will further acknowledge contact to FCA US LLC, regarding your 2016 Ram 1500.

Naturally, we were sorry to learn of this incident. Please rest assured, we appreciate and share your concerns about vehicle safety. It is important for you to remember that we don’t just design and build vehicles; we also drive them, as do most of our families and friends. We have some very close and personal reasons to be concerned about vehicle safety, like you, people depend on us to provide them with safe and dependable transportation. Needless to say, we sincerely regret the unfortunate fire that occurred.

FCA US LLC provided for Engineering Analysis Associates/Bosch Automotive Service Solutions to examine your vehicle. EAA is a leading supplier of technical field support to the transportation industry. They have hundreds of specialists in the United States that conduct thousands of product investigations each year, providing valuable automotive field expertise. FCA feels that the expense of this independent inspection is in the best interest of you, our customer, and the Corporation in our efforts to properly evaluate serious concerns such as yours.

The inspection involved a thorough examination of your vehicle and the photographing of all critical areas. After the inspection of your vehicle, the information at hand would not permit us to associate the fire with a manufacturing or assembly error. We are sure you will understand fires of this nature can and do occur for a number of reasons not associated with the manufacturing process. Therefore, we must respectfully decline any assistance associated with this matter.

Based on this, we suggest that you refer this matter to your insurance carrier. Should they feel a manufacturing responsibility exists, they have full subrogation rights under the terms of your policy, including your deductible.

Thank you for allowing us the opportunity in reviewing this matter with you.

Special Investigations
logo 4.png


I say bullshit.
**** FCA, after 50+ years of driving Mopars I'M DONE. My Eco has spent more time in the dealers hands than EVERY other Mopar I have had in my 50 plus years of driving them. When Fiat bought the company I knew we were in for this kind of shit. I spent 25 of those 50 years working on the vehicles for a living, and the reason Fiat left the US orignally was no one would buy their JUNK, and they have returned and turned a good American Company into JUNK.
 

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Discussion Starter #54
If it’s a well kept 2500 Cummins, I personally wouldn’t have any concerns at all with 72k for mileage...

Depending on pricing it’s usually better to let someone else take the new vehicle depreciation hit ..

Check the front crankshaft seal for leaking, It seems like all the Cummins 6.7’s eventually start leaking from this seal ... It’s a very easy fix , usually around 400.00 replacement cost...
worth looking at for a little wiggle room on pricing....

My brothers 2018 Cummins with 24 k started sweating oil , he had it replaced under warranty.. My 2016 Cummins 44k still dry ....
I dont think its to bad of a price its a laramie with everything minus a moonroof. I can get it for 35k out the door.
 

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russ209, I am glad that you were alone and could get out easy when this took place. My story was a little different and I should definitely document it here finally now that we all have had too much time on our hands with the pandemic.

Here is a link to a thread that I replied to with most of my 'thermal event' on January 3rd, 2020.

If you have not 'settled' with your insurance company yet, you should have your agent argue for you to get that number up as much as possible. While 24k sounds decent to me, too, it all is relative and the biggest arguments I faced were the miles on the truck (I had 40k more than you), there were no comparibles in the area (depends on your insurance company and how far they want to search -- for some reason, trucks in Texas would be worth $2k more?), and the arbitrary factor they 'Actual Cash Value.' This is not replacement value. This is arguably the wholesale price minus the cost to get a vehicle ready to sell. This is not a retail number or what a dealership would sell the vehicle for. It is not the number that you see on Craigslist or Cargurus for private sellers either. The insurance game is always in their favor.

Now, I took 2 months to agree to my insurance settlement and that was after FCA ignored me for 2 weeks. There is no way to call them directly. You have to play their game and deal with un/under-trained people answering the 800 number. They will not transfer you to the Special Investigation Group, only take your information and record everything you say on that call. I did get an email finally from a "Mr. Kahn." When you say that name outloud, you know what I was dealing with. He did call me and we talked at one point. That was the last phone call or conversation I had with Mr. Kahn. I do not know if he was fired or was re-assigned, but he was no help. His only response to my email with a list of my losses (which he requested I submit everything that was lost in the 'thermal event') was to say that FCA would do nothing and that they recommend I settle with my insurance company and they would then subrogate with FCA.

Eventually that is what I did, but I was not happy about it. Then before I signed over the title, I think it was Monday that week... I found out that FCA and two other independent inspection companies were meeting at Copart in Davidson (outside Flint, MI) to look at my truck at the end of the week. My truck had been moved the week prior without my consent, and the inspectors and even the Specialty Investigation Group at FCA believed that the insurance company already owned the truck. I said that if I was still the owner of that truck by Thursday I would be at that meeting and I would not be alone -- I would have definitely brought the press with me. I received three phone calls within an hour of the email I sent back to "Mr. Kahn." Plus, the email I received was not from Mr. Kahn. In those phone calls from my insurance company, one of the fire inspection teams and also from the subrogation team leader, they all wanted to reassure me that I did NOT need to be at that meeting. My response was the same -- if I do not receive the vehicle payoff check in the next two days, I will be there with representation.

My check arrived the two days later. I did not drive the 2.5 hours to Flint.

About 5 weeks passed... I get a call from the subrogation team. Interesting phone call. They are asking me about an unknown balance that looks to still be open for the rental vehicles I used after the 'thermal event.' Bill Marsh is my local dealership who gave me a 2020 Ram 1500 (not a diesel, come on, you know they are not renting ecodiesels) to drive. The 4WD system promptly broke on that truck that only 1200 miles on it, but that story is for another time. I had 4 other vehicles that I was given to drive until FCA did something about the 'thermal event.' About a week before the settlement I get a phone call from a person at Bill Marsh asking me about the rental vehicle. I ask it is fine, but why do you ask? They let me know that the people who went out of their way to get me a vehicle the morning after the fire -- 🔥 there I said it; yes it is a four letter word that starts with F -- those people had all been threatened with their jobs if they ever help an FCA customer in this situation again. The last thing I wanted to do was have my neighbors and the people who actually were helping me locally to be in trouble or fear for their jobs because they did the right thing. In that phone call, I said what are you really getting at? He said we have a balance here that needs to be paid. Ummm, I was never once given any indication that there would be a cost to me for the use of the FCA rental vehicles for my FCA truck that went from smoke to 🔥FIRE🔥 in less than 90 seconds and could have killed my entire family if it had happened the next time we had planned to travel (which was 36 hours from when it happened).

I took the rental vehicle back the following day and stopped the rental rates from accruing.

NOTE: I had my truck in because of it using coolant and it was documented on December 22nd, 2019. I was told that I was number 400 in the country to get the new EGR cooler installed and they knew they would be doing more than that with the intake likely to be replaced as well. I asked at that time for a rental/loaner vehicle and was told that FCA would not provide that service and the dealer (Watson Benzie) said that all four of their loaners were already out to customers waiting for everything from a rear end in a 2500 to an engine in something else (not an ecodiesel). They just said my truck is ready and have a nice day. I said, I am not leaving here without documentation. So they took another ten minutes to print out the report of their work, which they had pressure tested the cooling system (not at all what they told me there were going to do to investigate the EGR Cooler and intake) for 20 hours, and then I was out the door to find my truck running outside. How fun would it have been if it had ignited right there?! Oh, that would have been a great news story to have one burn up a dealership.

russ209, I am sooooo glad no one was injured in your fire, or my 'thermal event,' or any that I have heard of thus far, but I know for a fact that the fire would not be survivable. Had you not had professional firefighters there to put it out, let me just say that no normal fire extinguishers are going to put out the fire from the EGR Cooler failing. Do not try to fight this fire if is it beyond the smoking stage!

What people need to realize is that coolant is flammable at those temperatures. It is not just the normal hot gasses in the intake that cause this problem. They are meant to be in there, but the 'unburnt hydrocarbons' are waiting for another item to join the mix and then it is devastating.

Okay, got off track there, but I write all of that to say this:
The phone call was telling because I found out they knew about the rental cost and the difference between what my insurance company would pay $30/day for 30 days and we were at 52 days. The rental cost was around $36/day. I told the subrogation representative what I told the dealership and FCA and my insurance company: I was not going to pay a dime of the rental cost. That is something that FCA should take care of, this is all their fault. The truck fire was their fault, the threat to my health and my family, the delay in settling this the right way, and nobody knew what they were doing -- all because of FCA. The subrogation representative told me that the terms would be 100% and if I had paid the difference they wanted to add that to the amount that FCA would pay out in the process.

There is more to this story and if you read all of this, you might have some ideas of what is missing. It has now been a few weeks since that phone call and what I need to find out is if this has been finalized.

This is my first time dealing with anything like this. It is a huge learning experience.

A couple things:
1) This is only talking about the vehicle claim. There had to be a separate homeowner's claim for the items in the truck, accessories, etc. The vehicle claim does not cover anything beyond the stock vehicle (in my case, that was a Limited with every option except CD player), but vehicle insurance would not cover the BedRug, the winter front grill cover (oh, which should be required and provided with every ED -- it was 38-40 degrees outside when my 'thermal event' took place), or any other accessories.
2) With Subrogation, this is not something that an insurance company can profit from and the vehicle owner is part of the process.... though I was assured that once I settled with the insurance company that I would not be needed to provide any additional information. Then why did they call me directly to ask about the rental cost balance that was still outstanding?
2a) I did not inquire about the homeowners subrogation process or claim, but this was another $10k, of which I had to settle for much less due to how they factor Actual Cash Value (ACV), depreciation, and limits on values of items lost.
3) An interesting unknown still at this time is related to the salvage cost (actually titled as scrap in the State of Michigan), because my vehicle would never be allowed to be titled and used on the road again. When my insurance company's 'fire inspection group/team' stole my truck and had it sent to Davidson without my permission -- and they did not own the vehicle yet -- I then requested the number to buy the truck back. You still have the first right to buy the vehicle after the settlement numbers are known. This really put my insurance adjuster into a tailspin, and she came back with a number that shocked me. It was well over $3000. Therefore, my question to anybody who knows and has been through this, am I due that number that they sold my truck to Copart for a profit if they received 100% payment from subrogation?

I will never put my family in another Gen2 ecodiesel... recall 'satisfied' or not. We all know the AEM did not satisfy anything except the EPA lawyers. It only made things worse, and if you ask me I would testify that it contributed to the EGR Cooler failures.

Oh, and if you want to know if I am down on diesel engines, that would be a no. I replaced my 2015 1500 Limited Ecodiesel with a 2009 BMW e70 xDrive35d... it was already deleted and tuned (400hp/600tq). It is not something I want in my garage idling, but that is the only negative. Sure, it only tows 6000#, but even that big triple axle snowmobile trailer I pulled with the ecodiesel I would be able to pull with the BMW. My 7x16 cargo trailer, 8x16 car hauler flatbed, and my 20 Sea-Ray boat all tow better behind the BMW than the Ram. I get 24-26mpg, hand calculated and the computer is pretty accurate, with the BMW for everything around town to long distance up to 80mph (not towing) and forget about hesitation with setup. It is incredible for torque -- what the ED should have been and maybe is much better with the GDE old tune. My ED was not tuned, I thought it best to stick with stock and ride out the AEM warranty. I was wrong and it could have been deadly. Towing I get 19-21mpg around town, but have not had a real highway run with any of the trailers yet. My prediction is that it will get the 19+mpg up to 65mph and over that, wind resistance will be a huge negative for the boat and cargo trailer. The car hauler flatbed likely would be 22+, barely noticeable.
The other things that the BMW checked that the truck could not do -- 7 passenger, while not likely to be used for 7 passengers very often, it is nice to have a 6th seat once in a while for short trips. Though with COVID we should probably all be limited to vehicles that only have the seating capacity of our immediate family members. 😷 It rides better than the Ram, and that is saying a lot for me. The Ram with air suspension was the best driving and riding pickup I have ever been in, not just owned. Yes, the BMW has air suspension in the rear, so towing or loading it up in the cabin is no problem (within GVWR limits of course). The Ram was limited to something like 9200 pounds towing? I doubt I will ever need the extra 3000# towing capacity for my needs. If I do, I have plenty of options (parents have semis if it gets that far gone for towing needs). The BMW keeps my son's hockey equipment inside and out of the cold... though some would argue that the smell should be out in the cold! I really miss the cooled seats in the Ram, but the BMW is better for HVAC and better heated seats. Of course, the comic relief is that clearly my Ram had the hottest seats going... for a brief time.

The BMW is a 2009 and it has integrated anti-sway technology with the BMW towing kit/module. I had to have my vehicle coded / retrofit / programmed and BMW was nice enough not to touch my tune on the vehicle. I was going to delve into doing this all myself, but I was impressed that BMW worked with me and they went above and beyond to get my vehicle coded to recognize the towing kit. They even earned my oil changes for life because the vehicle is deleted, they do not charge me for DEF, it takes less time, and there is a difference of about $30 if I buy the oil and filter myself -- then I would still have to dispose of the waste oil. Plus, that includes their standard scope (diagnostic fee) which tests all of the systems (of which there are many).

The Ram had better audio, but that is an opinion more than a fact. The BMW is very good, but the Alpine in the Limited and the functions of the stock system, especially for XM radio, were much better in the 6 year newer Ram. I can spend considerable time and some investment in money to upgrade the iDrive system or all the way up to Apple CarPlay in the BMW if so desired, but the more I drive it, I realize that I just plain and simply like driving the BMW way more than the Ram. With snow tires (which I had on the Ram, also), the BMW is always going to be better driving in the snow/ice we have in Michigan. I had planned to drive that Ram for 10-15 years and 1/2 million miles. I could get 30mpg under 65mph with mine before the AEM, never saw 26mpg after. Towing I would get 14-18mpg with the Ram, which was acceptable. I was good with all of it before the AEM and then the fire.

As it is, I will never have an egr or egr cooler problem with my BMW. When you put your foot into the BMW, you move... not like the lag with the ED.

russ209, and to all ecodiesel owners/drivers, all the best. Keep us posted on how things progress with your claim and if FCA does anything more for you. They never sent me a letter saying they were sorry about this happening to me, but your letter is standard procedure. They are not going to give you a new truck, though I did request one in my list of losses... it has not arrived yet.
 

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Unless you need the towing capability I would look into a gas 1500.
The 2500 and 3500 have increased maintenance costs that would probably offset the fuel savings of the diesel.
If you do regular maintenance the Hemi is usually good for 150k miles before any major services, the only 'known' recurring problem has been timing chain issues related to MDS - which were addressed in 2018 I think.
 

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@russ209.... glad you got out safely... sucks ball sak that FCA loves you about as much as sewer rats. ( un freakin believable) I'm biased. I do alot of my own wrenching.. and at this point am ready to rip into my own engine to bullet proof it. I hope i dont have to. I do have a egd tune.. so i think i missed the missle. who knew what a nuke i may have missed. However... back to you... i think i would wait for the new tune from GDE come out and get that with a new 2020 eco. Chizzle1 makes a good point... do you need the towing power?? It's gonna come down to your personal taste.

If I had to do over.... i would get a 2020 or 21 eco.... i really am hooked on the ego's and style and function of the platform. Gm looks cheap and flimsy and loves to let vehicles that kill roll off the line, ford is my second choice as the quality has come up by leaps and bounds... but i still prefer the ram style overall. If my motor does have an issue.. I'll get another crate motor and bullet prof it. Im hooked.

Glad your safe. Good luck with your decision.🙂(y)
 

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Same here ^.
I'm probably going to do the EGR cooler delete next fall...don't want to take the chance the dealer will overwrite my tune when replacing the cooler.
No leaks yet, but from what I've seen it's only a matter of time...and most delete kits are ~$200 and can be completed on a Saturday.
 
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Something else I thought I'd add to this thread: not to take away from what sofa, gde, (insert your favorite tuner here) provide, but most users could accomplish the EGR disable with the HPtuner basic suite.
You won't get the performance benefits but you will get the longevity increase (and decreased risk of fire) from lack of soot circulation / EGR actuation.
It's as simple as poking out the diag codes on the PCM tab, takes about 10 mins.
This is also a viable way to backup the tune presently loaded without needing a spare PCM.
 
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