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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Okay...this is sort of a follow up on my previous post. A reply I received brought my attention to diesels' requirement for DPFs and possible problems with frequent short trips. (Thanks ChooChooMan74)

So I literally spent all day online researching diesel particulate filters (DPFs), exhaust gas recirculation systems (EGR), and such. I've been reading articles, searching forums, and even watching an informative youtube video posted by an AMSOIL representative. Holy crap! My head is spinning. I literally knew nothing about this stuff before today. The DPF sounds like it could be very troublesome and lead to costly issues. For example, as a result of these systems it's normal for fuel to eventually mix with the engine oil? I guess the amount depends on your driving conditions. This, it would seem to me, would increase wear to an engine. What effect will these systems have on the diesel's reputation for a reliable, long-life engine?

Many Europeans are quite literally sick and tired of the issues with these emission systems and are reverting back to petrol vehicles. While sales of diesels in Europe have had periods of outpacing petrol sales, it doesn't sound as if that will be the case much longer.

I think what I learned wasn't good for my particular situation. Even though I tow a 2,500 lb bass boat a lot from May through October, I don't tow anything during the cold weather months. During those same cold weather months, I'm driving daily with short trips of 5 miles in each direction to work. It would be my sole vehicle. Even with an added $2,800 up front and a $0.60 more per gallon fuel cost, the diesel still appealed to me. But, I also have to wonder what the future price of diesel fuel will be seeing as how popular diesel cars and trucks are projected to become. Now this "DPF thing" has added a very real potential for issues and costs. :( For example, ask your dealer (I plan to) what the cost will be if you have to replace your exhaust as we all eventually do. Maybe some of you can set me straight. I really, really, REALLY wanted to justify this new diesel!

One of many articles I found: DPF: The Time Bomb Under Your Diesel - Diesel Power Magazine

I might have to consider getting another HEMI. Not that that would be so terrible! :D ...convince me otherwise?
 

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once the warranty is up you remove the dpf exhaust and not have to worry about it.
I looked up the expected future price of diesel and in 2014 they estimate it to be $3.79
 

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once the warranty is up you remove the dpf exhaust and not have to worry about it.
I looked up the expected future price of diesel and in 2014 they estimate it to be $3.79

Diesel is $3.99 gallon in my hood. What is it in yours?

Regular unleaded is $3.50 a gallon.

Those prices are about average for here. Summer, diesel seems to go over $4.00 gallon.
 

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Okay...this is sort of a follow up on my previous post. A reply I received brought my attention to diesels' requirement for DPFs and possible problems with frequent short trips. ...I might have to consider getting another HEMI. Not that that would be so terrible! :D ...convince me otherwise?
The DPF technology is widely used and well-proven at this point, so I don't worry about it. It has come a long way since introduced. Except for the automatic regeneration cycle there is no user maintenance required. The DPF should last around 200,000 miles if we use the proper fuel and don't do something crazy. Articles like the referenced one from a few years ago that take a worse-case view are best read for entertainment, not decision making.
 

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It is something that we all have to deal with. The DPF on today's diesels is like the Catalytic Converter in the 70s. And look, who is trying to tear those off.

And no, you don't want to be tearing off your DPF in the future, especially in a state that has emissions testing. And, I bet that you wouldn't be able to trade in such truck, as a dealer doesn't want a truck that has been illegally modified. Plus, you also have to fool the computer into thinking that it is not there.
 

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Maybe it's a northern thing. But down here in the south plenty of people have the DPF removed and no one seems to care. it's no different than taking the cat off and tricking the computer, which on a diesel isn't hard at all.
 

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Just like LCR said. Most people I know just get dpf delete pipe and a tuner. I got a turbo back exhaust on my diesel and have never had a problem with inspection. Maybe your in more of a city setting but around here most diesel owners would be happy to see the the DPF or cat has already been removed.
 

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Hemi and Nail, just be aware that it is not legal to remove the DPF. I AM NOT ADVOCATING FOR OR AGAINST TAKING THIS OFF, OR KEEPING IT ON, SO I DON'T WANT TO START A FIRESTORM OF CONTROVERSY. I had a 2006 Ram 5.9 which is about the most desirable year because it does not have any of that stuff, EGR, DPF etc. I had a 2008 Duramax with DPF. After doing research in Pennsylvania, I called the PA State Police asking about the vehicle code, and if you get caught, it was more than a $3000 dollar fine. And my local inspection shop would NOT inspect the truck. So at that point I decided not to remove it.

My friend from high school has a 2012 Ram 6.7, he removed put an EGR block and removed the DPF, it picked up mileage in both city and highway, and it runs better.

It's an individual decision. If I had a truck like my 2008 Duramax, the LMM motor, 2007.5-2010 with just the DPF and I intended to keep the truck a long time, I would consider removing it.

With this new Ram 1500 with both DEF(urea injection) , and DPF (soot cooker), some company will come up with a delete for it. Probably let the motor breathe a little easier no doubt...
Every person's choice. If I buy a Ram 3.0 I'll probably leave it stock.

Marsman
 

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Marksman, I hear ya. Personal choice. I'm sure a lot of what we do to our vehicles if you look into it enough could be illegal. I have been pulled over many times and never had the cop look under my truck, sure it could happen.
Where I live they have made it against the law to hang your own drywall, install your own windows, or put on your own hot water tank but I sure as hell am not going to pay someone to do it.
Personal choice but some laws are made to be broken.
 

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For what it's worth, right now I have not heard of a working "delete" for the Ram 6.7's of '13 and '14. Scares me a bit because I expect to "delete" this new Motori rather soon after getting it.
 

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For what it's worth, right now I have not heard of a working "delete" for the Ram 6.7's of '13 and '14. Scares me a bit because I expect to "delete" this new Motori rather soon after getting it.
Nobody is going to market and advertise delete kits after the EPA has come down on these companies. I would love to not have a DPF, but it is reality now. As I said, this is like when the Catalytic Converter was introduced. They got that technology down pretty good. I am sure that DPFs are better now than when they were first introduced.
 

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I guy at a performance shop told me that a lot of people are leaving malls and finding that somebody stole their DPF. Apparently they go for a few grand.

I'd be tempted to take the sawzall (problem sawlved, lol) to it because there are no emission standards here. But i'm pretty sure there are a lot of computers and sensors that have to be "tricked". Best to see what kind of gain in mileage and power (if any) people are getting first. I'm all for clean air, but if we are burning more fuel, are we really benefiting?

Anyone know what happens when the DEF runs out? Some engines cut off, and i've heard of people having to piss in their DEF tanks just to get their truck to a service station.
 

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Anyone know what happens when the DEF runs out? Some engines cut off, and i've heard of people having to piss in their DEF tanks just to get their truck to a service station.
There is a gauge for the DEF on these. If you run out, then the gene pool needs thinning. I think I read that it goes into Limp Mode. Don't quote me on it.
 

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Nobody is going to market and advertise delete kits after the EPA has come down on these companies. I would love to not have a DPF, but it is reality now. As I said, this is like when the Catalytic Converter was introduced. They got that technology down pretty good. I am sure that DPFs are better now than when they were first introduced.
I looked this up and didn't know anything about it. I'm surprised Edge lost. I would think as long as it was marketed for off road use only the manufacturer would be fine. What the end user does us their business.
 
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I looked this up and didn't know anything about it. I'm surprised Edge lost. I would think as long as it was marketed for off road use only the manufacturer would be fine. What the end user does us their business.
EPA isn't stupid
 

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Guys the problem with just removing DPF vs DPF AND DEF is with the DPF it's another muffler, can it be detected? will law enforcement look under the truck most times? probably not.
If however you remove the DEF tank, that is more easy to identify, and when I talked to the PA State boys, they said the inspection station can be fined too, so I am not banking on making a change then hoping it will pass. Sure there are guys who know inspection stations out in back woods or small towns, but the reality YOU MAY OR MAY NOT GET CAUGHT, IF YOU GET CAUGHT, IT WILL COST YOU.

Plus if you remove any of this, the warranty is voided.... for a brand new vehicle, you are actually giving up something in the warranty, in order to make a change by removing DPF/DEF.
Again I am not advocating for or against it, every one is a big boy or girl and can do what they want. Just go into it understanding the possible outcomes.

Had a 2006 Ram Cummins, South Bend Clutch, head studs, program, suspension, turbo, it was modified, and ran good on lowest setting or on 5 it ran like a beast....
2008 Duramax I was on the edge of removing the DPF, but at the last minute decided ot leave it stock.

If I get a Ram, L630, will likely leave it stock...

and as LCR said "EPA is not stupid"...

Marsman
 

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No EPA is not stupid but "off road use only" has been around for a long time. It is nothing new.
I don't think there would be a need to remove the def just the dpf.
That's why I said wait for your warranty to be up before deleting the dpf but apparently it will not be an option.
I removed my cat about 5 years ago. Never have a problem with inspection or state police.
 

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Name 1 legitimate need to remove the DPF/DEF for off road use, and if you have one or two reasons how many people will actually NEED to remove those systems and maintain a 100% off-road nature being trailered everywhere
 

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That's not the point. There was never really a need to delete the cat for off road use but Turbo back exhaust were sold for years for off road use only meaning it was not legal to use on a inspected vehicle but thousand or hundreds of thousand did it. There are lots of mods sold for off road use only. It is then up to the end user.
If I was building my truck for drags or pulls I would delete all the heavy, power robbing stuff. The def has not proven to reduce MPG while the dpf has. That would be why I would want to remove it.
Tell me then "need" for any mod?
 

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Here is a perfect example. Although not EPA related it is a product marketed for off road use with little practical off road use. Would you not run these because fear of fines?


HELLA HLA-H83140171 H4 12V 100/80W Halogen Bulb Off Road Use:Amazon:Automotive

If you do a search there is a slew of off road use only parts sold. From headlights to cold air intakes, programs, tunes. The argument shouldn't be why but why not let it be up to the end user and the risk they are willing to take.
By the way. I did a quick search and there are still tons of dpf delete kits sold for almost every dpf equipped vehicle.
 
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