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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Backstory here:Knocking sound turned into a failed motor

Bottom end went on my truck, and FCA approved the replacement. The motor got to the dealer faster than I was expecting, and they just called me to let me know the truck was back together and they were test driving it around. They also said the NOx sensor needs replacing :rolleyes: So a few questions for you all:

1) I'm going to get GDE tuned. Does the GDE tune have the capability to ignore the NOx sensor?

2) It seems odd to me that the sensor would show no signs of failing and then die during the motor replacement. What is the likelihood that various components getting knocked around during the replacement could have killed this sensor? Service guy seems convinced that isn't possible. And he wants $729.xx for the sensor BEFORE labor.

3) What recommendations do you have for the break-in period? How many miles before my first oil-change? Which break-in method is preferred for this motor, hard and fast to seat the rings, or gingerly for 1000 miles?

4) Assuming I need to replace the NOx sensor, would you suggest letting the dealer do it? I've changed plenty of o2 sensors, but I'm a little hesitant since I've heard this is a particularly delicate sensor, and it's freaking expensive.
 

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I'm going to get GDE tuned. Does the GDE tune have the capability to ignore the NOx sensor?
No

What recommendations do you have for the break-in period?
Follow the break-in period listed in your owner's manual. I personally recommend easy driving for the first 500 miles. I don't do any towing for the first 1,000 miles.
 
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Wait how is the engine warranted but not the NOx sensor?
I could be wrong, but I think sensors are considered a wear and tear item and not covered under the powertrain warranty.
 

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I could be wrong, but I think sensors are considered a wear and tear item and not covered under the powertrain warranty.
Yes but they should cover the sensor under progressive damage aka say it got contaminated from the engine failure. Which was likely the cause.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Wait how is the engine warranted but not the NOx sensor?
I could be wrong, but I think sensors are considered a wear and tear item and not covered under the powertrain warranty.
Yes but they should cover the sensor under progressive damage aka say it got contaminated from the engine failure. Which was likely the cause.
So funny you all should mention that... today my original service writer told me that based on its location (he said it's back around the hitch area), it was very unlikely to be damaged during the process of swapping the motor over. Either way, the part had to be ordered and wouldn't be in until Monday or possibly Tuesday. So I said, whatever, order the part, but I'm going to do some reading and when it gets here, we'll talk about whether or not I want them to install it. He says cool.

Fast forward about 4 hours and I get another call from the dealership. Different service writer. He informs me the truck is all buttoned up and the NOx sensor has been replaced. I say, oh that was nice of you guys to do that and cover it. He says, "No, the cost is $729.xx which includes an hour of labor for the install, yada yada." I tell him that I DID NOT give my approval to install the part and that I was told it wasn't even in stock with an ETA of beginning of next week. So I ask him what the cause for the replacement was, and he tells me that there was physical damage to it, the harness, and it pulled a wire out of the module.

Needless to say, I'm not going to pay for that sensor. If there is physical damage to it, it surely wasn't there when I brought the truck in or it would have been throwing a code before the motor went. And now that they've put a good part on there, I can't imagine they'd pull it off and stick on the bad one. We'll see what they say on Monday when I go pick up the truck.

2nd service writer said the code indicating NOx sensor failure was P2200 which is bank 1. I don't know the underside of my truck yet, but there are 2 NOx sensors, correct? Seems odd for an upstream, aka bank 1 sensor to be all the way by the hitch?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Also, #2 service writer started telling me about the notes and the #5 cylinder was down about 30 psi on the compression test, and down 90% on the leak down. They won't be tearing into the motor per their protocol, but I sure wish I could see what exactly happened to that cylinder.
 

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The P2200 code is for the 1/1 Nox sensor which is in the down pipe just to the left of the engine, its in the engine bay. That code is for a hard electrical fault and which was not random odds are the tech spun it out without disconnecting the module and broke a wire.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
So I went and picked up the truck yesterday. When I get there, the service advisor tells me the cost to me will be $849.xx after tax. I explain to him that it's highly suspect that the sensor has physical damage since they just pulled the cab off the frame. He decides to get smart with me drawing a truck with the location of the sensor at the rear of the truck, then he asked "how do you expect to damage that sensor all the way back there when they're pulling the cab of the truck." Of course my response relates to the fact there are two NOx sensors, one pre-catalyst and one post-catalyst. He responds that he's pretty certain there's one NOx sensor, but he needs to check with someone who is at lunch. Fine, check with them and get back to me.

I left with the truck and then get a call about 5 minutes later telling me there is in fact one (1) sensor, and it's in the rear of the truck. This info is supposed to have been confirmed by the "director" with 25 years of experience. :rolleyes: Well I'm sorry, your director is wrong. The system operates using two sensors, and the code that started this whole replacement is telling you it's the FRONT sensor. Well, he has to check with the tech now. He'll call me back.

30 minutes later he calls and wants to video chat to show me the damage. Turns out the blue wire on the module get pulled out. He says that it's unlikely to have happened during the swap. Not sure how he can justify that, especially since he couldn't even get the right info about the number of sensors, but whatever. He starts being a hardnose saying "we were generous enough to give you an 18-day rental when Chrysler will only cover 5, maybe next time we just won't offer you a rental at all," "we've eaten so much cost already and we can't eat any more," and "if we have to, you can bring the truck back and we'll reinstall the broken part."

So the advisor is holding me to the price of $849.xx. I'm really frustrated because regardless of when or how the sensor got damaged, I NEVER gave them authorization, written or verbal, to install the sensor on my truck. Yet here I am, being backed into a wall to pay for something I did not request or authorize. I have already ordered the part so I have a backup if I have to take the truck back and have the broken part reinstalled, but I'm at a loss for how I should respond to any other communications from the service advisor. I can get over paying for a sensor that I didn't break, but I can't get over being forced to pay for a sensor that I explicitly told them not to install until they had talked to me.

Should I attempt to get RamCare involved? I don't want to be an ass, and I've been civil thus far in our conversations, and I don't want to burn the bridge with this dealership, but I'm really not going to pay $849 for this thing.
 

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Should I attempt to get RamCare involved?
Yes, I would get RamCare involved. I would be 100% cordial in the meantime.
 
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Yes, I would get RamCare involved. I would be 100% cordial in the meantime.
Thanks for your input, I'll reach out to them.

Does the NOx sensor need any special programming once you replace it? Because I don't want them to throw the old one on, I replace it, and then I'm still stuck in limp mode because the dealer has to do some special calibration on the part.
 

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Does the NOx sensor need any special programming once you replace it? Because I don't want them to throw the old one on, I replace it, and then I'm still stuck in limp mode because the dealer has to do some special calibration on the part.
A bad sensor will cause a code. Once you replace the bad sensor, you may need to clear the code, otherwise, there's isn't any special programming.
 
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Thank you all for your interest and responses. I wrote a lengthy email to the service advisor recounting the timeline of our communications as well as how I DID NOT give authorization and gave him a couple of options with explanations:

"1) I pay for the labor and the already installed OEM sensor (pn: 68171187AB) at the cost which I have already secured from a reputable vendor ($364.54 verifiable with attached receipt) for a grand total of $514.54.

or

2) I bring you a brand new, OEM, Mopar/FCA NOx sensor (pn: 68171187AB) on Friday 8/18 barring any shipping delays for the part, and you charge me nothing and return my card information.

In my opinion, the first option works out the best for both of us for a few reasons. First, it saves me, the customer, another trip up to the dealership. Secondly, you are still getting paid for labor which has already been completed and cannot be taken back.

The second option would be suitable as well, however now you're eating the entire cost of labor to install the part, and you've made it clear that there is little room left in your budget for this work order.

Of course the last option is what you have offered, I bring the truck up, and you swap the installed part out for the old one. This option really isn't great for you as now you're doubling labor on the part, still not getting paid for it, and you're tying up a bay which could be used to for other clients."

He promptly replied and agreed to option 1. So, while my replacement motor was not entirely free, at least this sensor has been installed by the dealership with an invoice to prove it. So all in all, I'm content. Now to get tuned!
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
That's good negotiating on your part.
Thank you. Probably the first time I've negotiated something like that (I never take my vehicles to the dealership). Honestly, I wasn't trying to milk the dealership, but I thought it was a good compromise.
 

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Kronus,

I also have a 2018 Laramie that is sitting in the shop waiting on a new motor. It was almost the identical issue to yours. Mine was at 49,500 and it suddenly lost power while driving, I got it pulled over, had zero oil pressure and had the same horrific noise you had. (This occurred 60 miles after an old change FWTW) Got to towed to the dealership and they are going to cover a new motor under the warranty. I have a couple questions if you dont mind. How long did it take for your engine to come in? Does the new engine extend your warranty, or have its own? And finally, did you get the same generation engine or did you get the new gen 3? Ive heard mixed reports on the answers to the last two questions. So far I have just been notified FCA approved the warranty but am still waiting on shipping and additional information. Thanks in advance.
 

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Does the new engine extend your warranty, or have its own?
No, you will retain the same 5 year/100,000 mile powertrain warranty that came with your truck.

And finally, did you get the same generation engine or did you get the new gen 3?
No, you will get the same 2nd gen engine that comes in all 2014 - 2019 trucks.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
How long did it take for your engine to come in?
Motor went on 7/24/2021 and the truck was towed in the same day. Dealer started tearing into it the next week, and had the pan pulled by 7/29/2021 confirming bearing material in the pan. I assume they had the motor ordered within a day or two of that. Got a phone call on 8/13/2021 telling me they were wrapping up the motor install. So approximately 2 weeks from time of diagnosis/ordering motor to completion of install. Honestly, I thought it would be longer than that given how busy they were at the dealership.
 
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