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Discussion Starter #1
Hi Guys,

From some of my other posts... you know I am not brand loyal... even though, I've owned 3 Ram's in a row. I've owed Chevy, Toyota, Ford.... etc.

Anyway... I was getting tired of all the BS I've been reading on the internet about the EcoBoost, and the EcoDiesel. If you go to a Ford BBS, they are bashing the new ED to no end. If you judged the new ED from a Ford BBS alone... you would think it was the biggest hunk of junk out there.

I personally think the Ford EcoBoost is a neat engine. I love turbo's... and I understand that if I force feed a smaller engine more air... in essence... You make a bigger engine. I even have a buddy with the Ford, and I've driven it a few times... and it's nice.


OK... here's the deal:

I am now in a VERY interesting situation. As you guys know... I just got my ED last week, and have been enjoying it. BUT, my dad decided he wanted a new truck too (he always gets the bug if my brother or I get something new) So... a few day's ago... he brought home a nice shiny, new F150 with the 3.5L EcoBoost !! So, I will be able to do an ongoing comparison on how the 2 trucks compare. I will not hold back info, and I will not be biased toward my Ram. I except to keep this thread alive for a long time.

Right now... we are still in a break in phase, so the MPG's aren't where they should be. BUT... I've already seen a 26 mpg on a short, mixed (50/50) drive. My Dad on the other hand, only got 18 MPG on a trip down to Virginia. (started the trip with only 50 mi on the clock) To be 100% fair... on the Ford boards... they say that they need a solid 1000 mi to break in, and have the MPG's climb.




Since we are a close family... I can borrow his stuff whenever I want. So... toward the middle of summer, I intend to do a few tow tests to get real world info.


Stay tuned for the testing.
 
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Should be good comparison....I am shopping for my truck now and having a hard time doing the math due to higher diesel prices vs better mileage....Can I ask what you paid as dealers seem to holding prices high around here.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Should be good comparison....I am shopping for my truck now and having a hard time doing the math due to higher diesel prices vs better mileage....Can I ask what you paid as dealers seem to holding prices high around here.
I got about $9500 from MSRP. I managed to get $4500 in rebates, and I was able to get 1% BELOW invoice. (about $5k) The MSRP on my Truck was $47,830.

I don't want this to turn into a MPG/$ debate. Also... I don't know what you drive now, or what you are looking at. (other than the ED) For me... I had a 2010 4.7L V-8 Ram, and I would get 15 mpg on average. (mixed driving) For a simple comparison... where I'm at, Diesel fuel is 15% more. BUT... the new ED is getting a full 65% improvement in MPG's !!! For me... that equates to a $900 to $1000 Per year savings on fuel.

If you want to continue that line of thought... start a new thread, and we can talk about it there.



OK... back on the EB Vs, ED debate....

Just to let you guys know... I don't intend to do anything other than "Real World" type tests. I'm not going to run them head to head on a drag strip... or run them in a tug-o-war. But, after they get a few miles on them... I intend to put the same trailer on both, and run a couple different loops. AND... run them empty, to check MPG's

I'm not even going to bother with the amenities, or opinion type comments, since the "Ford-Chevy-Ram" debate is as old as time.
 
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Sounds good Dr.. While waiting for my ED, I borrowed a 2012 F150 Platinum for about a month (work vehicle coming off of lease). While I did like the interior I was not impressed with the fuel economy. It got only 1 mpg better than my 08 Hemi ram. Since I was paying $0.25/mile to borrow I didn't take any road trips.

Can you post some liks to the other forums? I'd like to read them. Thanks in advance.
 

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I wouldn't bother, the 3.5L EB and ED are in two different classes. The 3.5L EB gets very thirsty when pushed but is very capable. I recall RAM engineers describing 'a knee in the curve' for the 3.5L EB's engine thirst when pushed. The ED is very fuel efficient but not as capable. I think Ford's new smaller displacement EB F150 is will be a better comparison to the ED even though it will won't be the best fuel economy.
 

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Should be interesting in the side by side comparisons.

The EB has the advantage of 365 hp which makes it a roadrunner and a better tower in the hi end tow range, but gassers are thirsty. From what I am seeing the ED is getting close to 10 mpg better than what the EB can achieve for equivalent weights. I think we will also find the ED can't be beat for towing level and moderate hills, but the EB will win on the heavier grades with more gas consumption.

The EB is a great engine but is starting to show some of its weaknesses. There have been more than a few that have thrown rods through the block in the past months, gas in the oil diluting it, timing chains and cam chains stretching and failing. They still do have problems in humid weather with power drops but not as bad as years ago. Since it is direct injection a big discussion on the F forums about carbon buildup on the intake valves, random misfires from the coil packs, spark plugs cracking and misfiring, collection of gunk from the emissions in the CAC. A PCV system that doesn't work while under boost, updates from Ford that seem to detune the engine (complaints from owners) and many complaints of poor gas mileage (class action rumblings going on).

I really do hope the ED exhibits a much better pattern of reliability since its being adapted to a truck environment. After all this engine was originally designed for the European Cadillac. So good luck to all with the EcoDiesel. I would probably be getting one also but, I already purchased my retirement truck a few years back. So unless I hit the lottery I will just have to sit and watch everyone else have the fun.
 

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The real difference will be found while towing a big trailer. I studied a lot of reviews and threads prior to ordering an Ecodiesel. The EB does a little better than a V8 at everything, but gas engines really suck gas when pulling a big trailer. Diesel engines respond to the heavier load much more efficiently. So I bet the Ecodiesel gets 25% better mpg around town and on the highway, but 75% better mpg towing a full size enclosed trailer.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
My dad just bought a 26' camper (about 7000 Lbs)... so that will be one of the test trailers. Along with my boat (22' Islandia at 5200~5500 with fuel and gear) and a utility trailer or my Jetski's for the light load.
 

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Let the war, I mean the debate begin. Turbos are a proven neat device to get max power out of a gas or diesel engine. The difference being a diesel thrives on more air being pumped in for combustion, while a gasser is restricted by close tolerances in fuel to air ratios. Hence, diesel engines become more efficient by adding turbo, while gas engines just becomes thirstier.
 

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Looking forward to the posts. I have a buddy with a F150 ecoboost - and Brother in law. Once I get my ED (maybe middle of May) I might be able to add some items as well.
 

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I bought my 2012 supercrew FX4 EcoBoost almost 2 years ago and now at 30,000miles with more than 1/2 of that towing - typically an enclosed car trailer at about 7,500lbs loaded. From a performance perspective, it is really tough to beat the EB. Towed the trailer (loaded) LA to Vegas on Friday and no problem to maintain 75mph up Baker grade with AC on and outside air temps at ~104F. The EB is a BEAST when it comes to power. But, I am on these forums researching the ED because the EB should not have eco in its name. It is a thirsty engine. On said trailer - empty (3200lbs) or loaded (7,000lbs) the EB averages right about 10.1 mpg. This measured mpg is from thousands of mile towing. Mind you, the EB needs premium fuel too as it is in boost virtually all of the time while towing. I'm not telling anyone something they don't already know but one of the biggest factors in mpg's is speed. Yes, I assume that the EB would do slightly better at 65mph or under and my avg speed is in the 70-75mph range. Not towing, the best mileage I ever got from it was 18mpg @ a steady 70mph. When I'm driving at a more typical 75-80mph not towing, I get 15 - 15.6 mpg.

In summary, the EB has been a great truck (now 31,000 miles on the odo), very powerful, but eats you alive on fuel costs. I'm looking at a ED and I KNOW I will be down on power but I really like the prospect of improved fuel economy towing and non towing. I think the Ram has the best interior of the Big 3 - although frankly I don't care for the exterior styling. I'll post more if I pull the trigger and trade the EB in!
 

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well i've got the same thread going on an EB forum - and its the one truck that i think is currently most likely to be compared to the Ram 1500 ED. they are both damn nice trucks. the F150 is probably the better "truck" truck though...bigger/stronger frame, more payload (towing & capacity). it is hands down quicker/faster.

the ED is by all accounts the "nicer" truck - better ride due to the coil springs instead of leaf springs, its interior is probably slightly nicer, and of course, the MPG (call me captian obvious on that one) is way better than the EB.

i priced out an EB and Ram 1500 ED with very similar option/trim packages, the EB was $1K more. i have fixed cost due to an employee affiliate program, so price was they were a wash. the EB has been out for a few years now and there are some problems (including a class action lawsuit) but i think that is more applicable to the 2011-2013 EB.

its going to be hard to objectively say THIS > THAT with these 2. they are slightly different animals and really going to be do you want MPG > Power/capacity or are you unwilling to give up Power/capacity for MPG? and 2015 will make this even more interesting with the lighter F150 and the 2.7L EB.
 

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Easy, slow down saves fuel. Do you have LT or ST tires on the trailer? Most ST tires are rated at 65MPH.

Sent from my GT-N5110 using Tapatalk
 

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Please - please - please - turn it into a fuel mileage report. I have friends with Hemi's and Ecoboosts. I know what they tell me. I also know that they are my friends and anyone who's a friend of mine has to be suspect.

Did not realize you needed premium gas to run an Ecoboost. Was with one guy on a 400 mile tow that fueled twice because he got 7 mpg with his Ecoboost. while towing. Don't remember that premium thing but never looked. If so, then that fuel is as much or more than diesel. On return, without the trailer, his fuel mileage still was just in the teens.
 

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Both truck's have there buyer's and good and bad point's , I looked at the EB before I bought the ED , For me I am not towing anything close to the max towing limit's on the ED and I drive a LOT of mile's every day , so for me the ecodiesel made more sense, Now if I didn't drive that much and had a 9000 lb trailer to tow then it would have been a different scenario,
I think it just depend's on how you are going to use the truck

mike
 
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Did not realize you needed premium gas to run an Ecoboost. Was with one guy on a 400 mile tow that fueled twice because he got 7 mpg with his Ecoboost. while towing. Don't remember that premium thing but never looked. If so, then that fuel is as much or more than diesel. On return, without the trailer, his fuel mileage still was just in the teens.
Anything turbo'd should run premium fuels, and premium kills the wallet. I have a 95 Suburban that has expensive taste, synthetic oil and premium fuel. Try running reg or even mid-grade and you quickly learn to left foot brake at idle so the revs stay up or you get shaken to pieces. Around Atlanta premium has been running around 3.90/gallon and diesel 3.6/3.70. I figure that's most of my payment saved in fuel cost saving and mpg increase from 14 mpgs in the Suburban, never mind the glorious comfort of a real ac system in the Ga summer heat.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
HI Guys,

I know I haven't made any updates on this... but we are still waiting for my dad's new travel trailer to show up. According to the dealer... it should be here by the end of the week, and since the weather has kind of sucked here in PA... I JUST got my boat uncovered on Friday. (about a month later than normal)


Without a doubt... I think the Ford EB will out tow our beloved ED. But as CoolTech said... the "Eco" in the EcoBoost is bogus. Right now... my dad's Ford doesn't show any better than 16 mpg. Basically... YES... it makes true gas V8 power... but it still drinks V8 fuel.
 

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Comparing the wrong Ecoboost to the Ecodiesel. Ford is banking on the 2015 F-150 with the 2.7L Ecoboost to be a competitor to the Ecodiesel.
 
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