[B-g-K]

If I follow there method of removing pump and letting the UREA falls happen...there is know way I am catching all 8 gallons. I am going to attempt to syphon the tank first into buckets.

Use a kiddie pool

 

[mustangguy289]

Use a kiddie pool

Removing those 3 bolts did not remove the whole assembly and I was too scared to try to pry it out of a $1500 tank. I removed tank, stuck a tube down the filler hole to keep the valve open, picked up the tank, and let gravity empty it into containers. Very easy and mess free.

 

[mustangguy289]

BTW... there were absolutely no signs of crystals. Tank is still reading 1/2 full no matter how much I have in the tank. I expect the CEL to come back on this afternoon on the way home from work.

 

[Anomaly]

Well so far the gauge still reads 1/2 full. Even when it was bone dry. Had a friend reset the CEL light. We will see if it comes back on tomorrow. If so It is going to the dealership. Now the real debate...is the DEF level sensor covered under emissions warranty at 37k miles or not?

I thought that I had posted this already.... must have been in another discussion. Here it is again.
This is a quote from the EPA regarding emission components.

The diesel SCR catalytic converter, Diesel oxidation converter, and the Diesel Particulate Filter (DPF) are considered catalytic converters covered under the 8
year/80,000 mile warranty, however, the other components in the SCR system (e.g. exhaust sensors, DEF tank, valves, hoses, etc) are covered under the 2 year/24,000 mile warranties

Joel Ball
Light-Duty Vehicle Group
Compliance Division
United States Environmental Protection Agency

 

[mustangguy289]

No light so far.

 

[mustangguy289]

200 miles in. No cel and gauge has finally moved.!!!!!!

 

[Haul N Grass]

Thanks for the updates , I'm sure everyone is appreciating your information!!!!

 

[mustangguy289]

Well I bought another 2.5 gallons to fill the tank. The gauge never moved and about 50 miles later the CEL came on. DEF system is going bye bye.

 

[2443]

The Ram system appears to be very problematic - perhaps because of how it is executed or maybe it's just junk. Nearly every make of diesel is suffering now because of this. I truly feel you will appreciate your truck so much more with that crap removed. I'm not an advocate for polluting, but clearly, this system does not work as intended. We should not have to spend thousands on faulty parts that claim to clean the air.

 

[97hmcs]

Well I bought another 2.5 gallons to fill the tank. The gauge never moved and about 50 miles later the CEL came on. DEF system is going bye bye.

I was hoping for you to have better results. My DEF gauge has been stuck at 1/4 for the last 3-4 thousand miles. I haven't added any DEF and I don't have a CEL. Probably no CEL since I have the GDE tune

 

[Anomaly]

IMO, the problem with our DEF gauges is that FCA took the cheap way out. For cost reasons, they decided to build the DEF sensor into the DEF tank. From what I can tell from the MOPAR parts list, you have to buy the tank/sensor combo at a cost of around $1500. Please correct me if there has been any update on this info.

It would make far more sense had they used a replaceable sensor. There are several technologies that would work, ranging from ultrasonic, capactive to plain old tech float and potentiometer. Here is one replaceable sensor that has been developed just for DEF.

SSI Technologies' selective catalytic reduction system diesel exhaust fluid (DEF) combination sensor monitors urea level, temperature, and concentration and is designed to meet pending worldwide emissions regulations for on- and off-highway OEMs. The combination sensor is an in-tank design with onboard diagnostic capability that uses ultrasonic technology and offers detection of 10% or greater water dilution of DEF; detection of DEF contaminants such as diesel fuel, water, windshield fluid, brake fluid, motor oil, gasoline, and anti-freeze; 0.5-mm (0.02-in) resolution DEF level monitoring; operator notification of any diesel miss-fills; temperature monitoring for heating management; and redundant indication of empty tank. The sensor is programmable for profiling to regular- or irregular-shaped DEF tanks.

 

[Captainmal]

Probably no reasonable way to fit one like this into our old tank and then actually get it to work with the Ram electronics. Bummer. Simple should be simple.

Good research.

 

[Anomaly]

Probably no reasonable way to fit one like this into our old tank and then actually get it to work with the Ram electronics. Bummer. Simple should be simple.

Good research.

Fitting a sensor to the tank mechanically is probably doable, but interface to the electronics would be a very difficult.

 

[mustangguy289]

For the hell of it I syphoned out 3.5 gallons which should take it down to 4 gallons in the tank. After 105 miles, the CEL light went off. ...This dang thing just doesn't like to be full. Oh well, by next weekend this crap will be in the attic!

 

[Tookielee]

Reading the warranty, it looks like if your state requires emissions testing, and will penalize you in some way for not passing, emissions warranty has to pay.

 

[mustangguy289]

Reading the warranty, it looks like if your state requires emissions testing, and will penalize you in some way for not passing, emissions warranty has to pay.

Texas only does safety inspections on diesels.

 

[cljensen]

This is interesting. I have a 2014 with just under 62K on the clock, same P203E The DEF gauge is reading empty but the tank is full and I was getting warning messages that the truck would not restart in 100 miles and counting down. Of course, my dealer swears that he has never seen this DEF tank issue before.

:So, I took it to the dealer who told me I need an entire new DEF tank at a cost of close to $2,600 and change for the parts and labor. Never a mention of just removing and flushing out the tank. Is there a service bulletin or other documented procedure regarding how to do the flush? Nothing will be covered under warranty.

At about 32K +-, I was getting codes (forget which ones) that there was something wrong with the emissions system. After taking it 3 different dealers, who only reflashed the ECM and somehow forced a regeneration (none of which cleared the codes for more then 15 miles), the 4th dealer actually did something. He found that the gizmo that squirts the DEF into the exhaust was all caked up with DEF crystal and the catalytic converter was ruined, along with a few sensors. They gave me a loaner truck but it took a few weeks for them to get all the parts in and installed.

At about 45K+-, I was getting low fuel rail pressure faults and the engine would just shut off, mostly when the fuel tank was 3/8 full or less. After 4 tries and 6 weeks in the shop to replace the injector pump, injectors, lines and a bunch of other stuff that cost RAM over $12K in parts and labor (covered under warranty), the truck stalled out on me again 4 times. So, I contacted a lawyer who is negotiating (supposedly) with FCA for them to buy my truck back. Hopefully this will happen before I get stuck with another $2.6K repair bill.

 

[mustangguy289]

I have not seen the TSB but I was told the rules.

Remove tank- Unbolt the plastic shield. Disconnect the 3 wire connectors. Disconnect the lower DEF line. (Push in on tabs and pull. Be patient, it took me a few tries to get it undone. You do not want to break this. Pushing gently on a tabs with a small screwdriver helps.
Disconnect large filler tube (this one is easy). Once this is disconnected you can push in a syphon tube and slowly syphon out. However, I am impatient so I put a jack underneath the tank and proceeded to unbolt the two straps from the frame. Lower the tank slightly and disconnect vent tube (connected to filler tube) on the top. You are home free and can remove tank. All tubes disconnect by a push in on tabs and pull to release. Once tank is out, you have to hold the flapper open on the filler entrance then turn it upright and empty def into containers. ( I held the flapper open by simply inserting my syphon tube into the tank)

Fill tank with 7-8 gallons of distilled water. Let it sit for atleast 30 minutes (overnight if you have time). Empty tank.

Reinstall tank. All tubes just push on until you feel the positive click.

If you have a CEL scanner/delete tool go ahead and delete the code now.

Turn the ignition to run (do not start) and leave on run until next step is complete.

Fill DEF tank 1 gallon at a time. (The dealerships go ahead and put 8 gallons in). I only did 5 gallons for my first test. After about 150 or so miles the gauge finally jumped from just under 1/2 full to above 1/2 full and the light never came on. Then i filled the tank up and guess what...CEL came back on within 50 miles. I syphoned out 3.5 gallons and after about 150 miles the CEL went back off.

I am now deleted with GDE tune and will never worry about this DEF bs again.


FYI..I was NOT able to insert syphon tube through the DEF filler where you fill DEF. The filler tube is way too long and curvy to push it in (that's what she said).I had to get under truck and disconnect filler tube and push syphone tube into tank.

 

[vindiesel]

Here is your DEF tank.

 

[mustangguy289]

Here is your DEF tank.

View attachment 15457

not anymore